Questions and Answers with Baba
by Eruch B. Fanibunda

1976

Web Posted: July 28, 1999, Gurupoornima .

Q: What is the correct relationship Swamiji, which exists between God and a devotee?

Baba: 'I am yours,' can only be said from the devotee. 'I am yours God,' says the devotee and what does God say? 'You are Mine'. God does not say, 'I am yours.'

Q: In that case Swamiji, a disciple should never say to God, 'You are mine.' Is that correct?"

Baba: Yes, I will explain this connection in detail by an example, which Swami has often given on previous occasions: The waves on the surface of an ocean have no independent existence of their own. They cannot exist if the ocean is not there, but the ocean will continue to exist if the waves are not there. The waves have to depend on the existence of the ocean for their own existence but the ocean is independent of the waves. This has to be clearly understood. Now a wave can say, 'I belong to You,' because it cannot exist without the ocean. But the ocean will never say, 'I belong to you,' because it can exist without the waves.

Therefore, the appropriate thing for a devotee to say to Swami is, 'Lord, I am Yours.' There is no point in his saying, 'You are mine,' because the Lord can exist independently of the devotee. The individuals are like the waves and the Lord is comparable to the ocean. There is an inseparable connection between the two, also known as Avinabhava. If you say, 'I am Yours,' that is enough and appropriate. After that if you say to the Lord, 'You are Mine,' it is absolutely meaningless. You could say, 'You are Mine,' if I was separate from you, but since you and I are One the question does not arise.

Q: Swamiji, what is the secret behind all these names and forms? How can one acquire this Divine Bliss?

Baba: To understand the Secret of Creation and aspects of Divinity through such human examples, is possible only to a limited extent. It is not possible to gain complete understanding through such examples. You will understand the reason for Creation when you understand the reasons for all the small things, which are taking place in daily life. For instance, if one were to inquire as to why one gets a dream, then different people will give different explanations.

Some will say it is due to the thoughts; others will say it is due to the kind of food, indigestion, and so on. But the thing responsible for dreams is sleep. Because you slept, you dreamt. Similarly, if you have the resolve (sankalpa) you suffer the illusion, or maya. If there is no resolve there is no illusion. For example, when it is dark, if you see a log of wood in the distance and know that it is a log of wood, then there is no fear. But if you see the log of wood and imagine that it is a ghost or a devil, then you will see it actually moving in your imagination.

The moment you think like that, the log of wood actually becomes a ghost or a devil, it actually moves and you suffer the illusion. There is no great force or something else from outside which has created the ghost or the devil. It is simply your thought process, which has created the illusion.

There is another small example. After the bhajans are over, suppose you are walking back home and there is dim moonlight illuminating the road. There is a small thin piece of rope lying across the road. The moment you see the rope, if the idea gets into your mind that it is snake, then immediately fear takes possession of you and instantly you move away from the rope. When you look at it with a torch-light, you realize it is a piece of rope. The moment you realize, it is a piece of rope, all fear is gone. You pick it up and throw it away. In the first instance you moved away with fear and in the second instance you came near, picked it up, and threw it away.

All the time it was only a piece a rope and so what was it that prompted the fear in the first instance and drove it in the second instance? The only thing responsible for all this is the illusion in your own mind. Neither has a snake come nor it has gone. What has come and gone is your own illusion. This is known as Avarnam and Visargnam. ('Avarnam' means to obscure or veil and 'Visargnam' means to illumine or shed ignorance.) Both of them—the notion that it is not a snake and the notion that it is a rope—come and go simultaneously. The notions do not follow each other, but occur simultaneously.

As long as you have the feeling that this is your human body and the associated body consciousness, then all the attendant responsibilities and attachments, which go with the possession of a human body and the relationships with other bodies, will persist. The moment you realize that you are not the body, then at that very moment all the attachments and delusions will disappear. This is referred to as removal of sorrow and coming to you of happiness and bliss. Just as the illusion of the snake was replaced simultaneously with the knowledge of the rope, in the same way the illusion that you are the body is replaced by the realization that you are the Spirit (Atma); all the attchments will drop away and simultaneously you will have the bliss of the Spirit (Atma). That is Mukti or Liberation. The knowledge that you are Divine will dawn on you and simultaneously the sorrow will disappear and bliss will come.

Mukti or liberation has not come and fallen in your lap from the heavens. It has not been dug out of the depths or the bowels of the earth, and given to you. This has simply come to you by the removal of this wheel of ignorance. The moment the wheel of ignorance has been removed; what has already been with you, has now become manifest to you, the liberation has always been with you.

Divinity is present everywhere, so how can you say that it has come from somewhere to you? There is no meaning in saying that liberation has come. There is no Divine aspect coming from somewhere and going to some places elsewhere. These are simply our notions, which come and go.

Q: Swamiji has explained everything very clearly, including the inseperable connection between the devotee and the Lord. Now, would Swami please explain the nature of the connection between the mind and the body; or the relationship of the five 'layers' (spiritual bodies, Kosas) with each other, with the mind and the soul?

Baba: The human body has five outer senses, which are useless—unless they are supported by the mind (or the Mano-sakthi). The mind is again supported by the Spirit (Atma-sakthi) and without this support, it cannot function. Thus, the body contains Matter (Deha-sakthi), Mind (Mano-sakthi) and Spirit (Atma-sakthi). That is: physical strength, mental strength, and Divine spiritual strength.

The five layers (kosas) are: the food-layer (Anna-maya), the mind-layer (Mano-maya), the layer of air (life force, Prana-maya), the layer of wisdom (Vignyan-maya) and the layer of bliss (Ananda-maya). The last two are formless and therefore, they cannot be seen. You can only enjoy them.

Now suppose you are walking on the road and there are some glass pieces lying scattered on the road. The legs, which are walking cannot notice these dangerous objects, but the eye from a height sees them and immediately messages are sent via the brain, to various muscles of the legs for appropriate action. Now what is the relationship between the leg and the eye? Is it not the same blood, which flows through the eye and the leg? So in a similar manner a connection exists between the Body, the Mind, and the Spirit. It is the same Spirit (Atma), which is flowing through all these three and that is the Inner Connection.

In Vedantic parlance, this is explained as Unity in a set of diverse phenomena and Diversity in one single unit phenomenon. When we talk about Diversity in Unity, what we mean is, that this one Spirit which is Unity, is manifesting Itself in diverse ways like hearing, smelling, seeing, talking and touching. All these manifestations are diverse forms of the one-and-the-same Spirit. Not a single of these manifestations will function if the Spirit is not there. Is it possible for even a single eye to function? No, the senses have no individual importance of their own standing. It is the same Spirit flowing through the five layers of the human body (Panch kosas) and it simply shows that everything is dependent on this one Spirit for its existence; nothing can function without the Spirit.

In the Bhagavad Gita it has been said, 'I am the one seed and from this seed have come the trunk of the tree, the branches, the leaves, the flowers, the fruits, and also the roots.' All these forms are separate from one another and have distinct names and functions, but all are contained in the one seed. Further, the seed, the One, is also contained in the tree. Thus, we have Unity in Diversity and Diversity in Unity. One Spirit with many forms, and many forms, containing the One Supreme Spirit.

In Wisdom there is no good and bad. It is only in the mind associated with the form and the characteristics. There is only the consciousness (Brahman) with different names, forms and characteristics. The potter makes so many different sizes and varieties of pots, all from the same mud. The basis is the mud. A pot will not hold water unless it is baked in a fire. Similarly, the body is also a pot with the ten inner and outer senses (Indriyas). They are the 'ten holes' through which the water of Grace leaks out and to block these holes, one has to put it through the fire of Wisdom. Then the Lord’s Grace will remain with you.

Q: Swamiji, what are the eight qualities of the Supreme Spirit—the Oversoul (Paramatma)?

Baba: The Supreme Spirit (Paramatma) has eight qualities and Shri is the most important one. First, is the quality of sound (Shabda Brahma mayi). Then, Omnipresence (Charachar mayi), the Light of Wisdom (Jyotir Mayi), Speech (Vang mayi), Permanent Bliss (Nityanand mayi), and the sixth is beyond the senses (Paratpara mayi), the seventh is Illusion (Maya mayi) and eight

is all kinds of wealth and prosperity (Shri mayi). These are listed in the Bhagavad Vibhuthi Yoga.

Q: Swamiji, what is this Illusion, or Maya mayi?"

Baba: Maya means body. The body is a disguise of the Supreme Spirit (Paramatma). That is the illusion.

Q: And what is the meaning of the eight quality, the Shri Mayi, Swamiji?

Baba: It means the Omnipresence, comprising all types of wealth, worldly wealth, the wealth of wisdom, the wealth of intelligence, wealth of enjoyment and all the other types of wealth and prosperity. Because Arjuna had wealth of intelligence, Krishna used to address him as Arjunam, Savyasachin and Dhananjaya. Once Urvashi (a Divine woman) prayed to Arjuna to marry her. Arjuna replied that he had given his mind to Krishna and that she was like his mother. Thus, Arjuna showed great sense control in face of her temptations.

Q: Sometimes one gets a feeling that One is very close to God and at other times one feels that God has moved very far away. Would Swami please explain the reasons for those feelings?

Baba: Jealousy and anger are responsible for these feelings. If these are controlled, then one is in a position to control the Supreme Spirit (Paramatma). That is, Swami comes near, otherwise he appears far from you. Sometimes the boys (referring here to His college boys) do not understand as to why Swami appears to be angry with them. They have to realize that their thoughts, which Swami knows, are responsible for Swami’s reactions.

Here is a small story. Once King Akbar was informed by some of his Moslem noblemen, that Guru Nanak was enjoying great popularity with a large section of the Moslem population and he should be firmly put down. Now Akbar had a Hindu mother, so he was very tolerant towards non-Moslems and he invited Guru Nanak to visit his palace. But, Nanak refused the invitation and said, "I have only one King and that is God. Worldly kings are there and gone tomorrow. I pay homage only to God."

Akbar realized the wisdom in Nanak’s reply, so he invited Nanak to pray in a mosque. At the mosque, Guru Nanak created a commotion by laughing loudly when the priest began to recite the prayers. All those assembled there were angry with Nanak, but Akbar counseled patience. Then Akbar began to recite the prayers and to the surprise, Nanak began laughing even louder.

Now Akbar demanded an explanation of Nanak’s behaviour and in reply Nanak said, "You were thinking of your Arabian horses (Akbar had received these as a gift the day before) during the recitation of your prayers and the priest was thinking of his ill son. So what could I do but laugh at this hypocrisy." His reaction was based on their thoughts and not on their external behaviour. Swami is not affected by external appearances or performances. Swami is always looking for internal purity only.

Q: What is the inner meaning of the live Cobra lying under Swami, when Swami was a new-born baby?

Baba: It means Vishnu. That is, the Supreme Spirit (Paramatma) reposing on the Snake (Shesha).That is to say all the undesirable qualities are under Swami, in other words; under Swami’s control. Swami is above the gunas, the three qualities. Krishna dancing on the head of the serpent Kaliya, means the same thing.

Q: What is the significance of the Kalki Avatar, Swamiji?

Baba: The word Kalki refers to the Avatar of the Kali Yug. The horse (aswa), signifies the mind which is perpetually restless. Never steady. The horse is always moving its tail or leg, or ear and the restless mind is compared with it. Only the Avatar can fully control the mind and therefore, this Avatar is always shown with a Horse. The Banyan tree is called the Aswatta tree, because its leaves tremble at the slightest sign of breeze. Just like a Horse it is restless and shivers in every leaf. The ancient rite called Aswamedha, or the rite of Horse-sacrifice, is so named because it means sacrifice of the wayward mind, symbolized by the Horse.

Q: Swamiji, when one’s mind and vision progresses from dualism (Dwaita) to Visishta-adwaita and then on to non-dualism (Adwaita), does it imply God realization?

Baba: No, that is not the real experience. God realization means the experience of knowing that you are God. In words it can be described as an experience of Peace, Bliss and Light."

Q: Swamiji, what is the main obstacle in our path leading towards this experience and vision?

Baba: The image (mirror) is not clean so how can it reflect? It is covered with a layer of dirt accumulating from action. This action results from duties and worldly responsibilities. See this curtain (in the interview room), it is made up of two weaves, one vertical and the other horizontal. They are duty and worldly responsibilities, which weave the curtain and it is this curtain which hides the Vision.

Q: But Swamiji does not mean that we should neglect our duties and worldly responsibilities?

Baba: No Bangaru! [Swami's term of endearment, meaning 'gold']. You must dedicate all actions to God and regard Him as the Doer and not yourself. The moment you consider yourself as the doer, you have the desire for its results. Give up this fruit to God, and also give up the idea that you are the performer of actions.

Man has a right to perform action, but no right for its fruits. Consider yourself merely as His Instrument. Then slowly, there will not be any dirt left to cover the mirror in which you are seeking His reflection. Do not make the mistake of separating the actions into actions for yourself and actions of God. For instance, you may give charity and consider that for God, and your other worldly duties for your own self. That is wrong. Consider every action big or small, even the act of breathing, for the sake of Swami. Then the curtain will dissolve. You will have eliminated the warp and the woof of which it is made.

Q: But Swamiji, can you not lift it a little and let us have a little peek, a preview?

Baba: No. Swamiji cannot do that. First you have to eliminate the ego and then Swami’s grace will take away the curtain.

Q: Swamiji has mentioned about actions being dedicated to Swami. What about Lust? Can that be dedicated to Swamiji also?

Baba: Yes of course, why not? If you see Me in Lust, it will be instantly purified. You will not care for it anymore because it will be transmitted into Love. Take this small example. You have a child and having put the child on your lap, you fondle it with Love and tenderness. You are actually seeing Me in this child. Now in case of your wife, the mind gets feelings of lust and desire for possession and enjoyment. But if you see Me in your wife, then automatically such feelings will gradually diminish and you will have pure love for her as well.

When such a love develops, then feelings of 'mine' will disappear. You begin to see Me in each other. Purity of mind is very essential before one can see the reflection of the Spirit.

Q: Sometimes people ask us that if Swamiji is God, then why does He not remove all the sufferings?

Baba: It is not that Swami has no 'desire' (ichcha) to remove the suffering, but how is it possible for Swami to accept part-time devotion and give full-time payment? Swami has a great 'desire' to give happiness to all mankind, but mankind itself is responsible for the good and the bad it experiences. God’s grace can change your destiny, if you so desire. All the good and all the bad, are merely reflections of the various activities in this world indulged in by mankind. The world is not constituted of earth and mud only. There are people in it as well and the earth and the people are inseparably bound with each other. They cannot be separated.

Today, man has developed very wasteful habits and all the earth’s resources are being wasted. Man wastes water, food, sound, and light (amongst millions of other things). For instance, he talks loudly where soft speech would suffice. Unnecessarily he eats a large meal, and also wastes a lot of food. He uses two buckets of water where one would suffice. When one can do with a little light, why is it necessary to have a brighter light and waste electricity? All energy and resources of the earth are a manifestation of Paramatma and when one wastes anything, one is wasting God. For every act of man, there is Reaction, Resound and Reflection."

Q: Does Swamiji suffer sorrow or happiness?

Baba: Sorrow and happiness are seen by you only because of your dual nature. God only sees One, not many. Of course, the seed of activity (Karma) is there and that brings forth your destiny.

You reap whatever you have planted. God sees only One. There is a tree with its roots, trunk, branches, leaves, flowers and fruits. It is a manifestation of many forms and attributes, which have all come from the One seed. Take the example of soil or earth. There is sweetness in sugarcane and various fruits. The sweetness is really contained in the One earth just as the tree is in the One seed.

Similarly for all the names, forms and attributes, the One Divinity is the basis. Because I know the Truth fully, that all are Divine; that everything is Divine and that there is no Jiva (individuality) other than Divinity, there is no time or occasion when Swami has suffered pain, or pleasure, or sorrow. At no time does Swami suffer any of these things. When someone comes to Me and says that he is suffering great pain or sorrow, I very much want to feel and see what pain is like or what sorrow is like. But it has not been possible for me to experience either pain or sorrow. Since such people have not understood this aspect of Mine, I pretend and look sorrowful or as if I am suffering. I pretend, so that I may correct them, put them on the proper path and make them understand me. I am telling you these things through truthful personal experience and these are not some imaginary statements.

In Me there is no such thing as sinking at some worldly sorrows or being elated at some worldly achievements. "My Life Is My Message" has been said in this context and if you try to follow Me, you will also have an enormous amount of peace and bliss.

Q: Yes Swamiji, it is our dual mind and desires which are responsible for all this so-called good and bad! In the past Swamiji has advised Satsang as a beneficial activity for one’s spiritual practice. How does it help? ('Satsang' means in company of Truth. The implication being that one must keep the company of those who are seekers after Truth and avoid the company of the worldly-minded.)

Baba: If you take an earthenware pot filled with water and leave it standing in the open, then the water level inside will drop due to evaporation. But if the pot is surrounded by water then the level will remain steady. In the same way, spirituality should fill the pot of your heart to its very brim and then to maintain that fullness, it is necessary for you to keep satsang. Otherwise, the level of your spirituality may drop due to leakage and evaporation in a non-spiritual atmosphere. The same purpose is served by the Sai Organizations. It protects your spiritual practices like a wet cloth around the earthenware pot.

Q: Swamiji, what is this state called ‘Death’? What is the relationship of our mind with that state?

Baba: Death is a state very much like sleep. The individual discards his body like an old worn-out suit of clothes. Only the body perishes. As the mind has no physical form, it does not perish with the body, and though activity persists even after the death of the body. The stream of thoughts is the mind. The permanent Soul is like a lamp and Intelligence is like the light of this lamp. Thus the Intelligence sheds its light and discriminates between right and wrong. Walter Cowan’s experiences [Cowan died and was brought back to life by Baba] after death need not be the same for everyone. After the death of the physical body, it is impossible for the disembodied spirit to contact this material world.

Q: Then Swamiji, what about these so-called Ghost recordings, photo radiations and manifestations?"

Baba: These are all false. It is the mind, which performs these things by deep concentration. The spirits cannot contact the material world but the mind can produce recordings and material changes in this physical world. The so-called radiation produced from a photograph, is also an activity of the mind. It is a projection of the mind itself, and it is also the mind which observes it. 'The beauty of an object lies in the eyes of the beholder'. The mind is responsible for creating this beauty and also enjoying the beauty.

Q: Swamiji mentioned concentration of the mind just now. How is it related to meditation?

Baba: The word 'Dhyana' or Meditation is being interpreted by many people in many different ways, and thereby they are causing some confusion. The Sadhana or practice by which the three constituents namely, the meditator, the object of meditation(God) and the process of meditation are unified, is called Dhyana. It is not to be equated with concentration or single-mindedness. All the routine acts like eating; drinking and walking are due to concentration. This concentration is subservient to the five senses of perception.

For instance, to read a paper, your hands have to hold it, your eyes have to see the print and the mind has to synthesize all these activities. Similarly, to drive a car a lot of concentration is required for manipulating and synchronizing all the controls. To raise the mind above the level of the senses and the sense objects, and have the Divine as the objective, is called Meditation. So, meditation is above the senses and concentration is below the senses. Suppose there is a rose plant. Now your ability to distinguish between thorns, leaves, branches and flowers, is called concentration. Having identified the rose, you pluck it out without touching the thorns. Now the flower is separate and it has no relationship with the rest of the plant. The separation of the flower from the plant is called contemplation. You offer this flower to God. After the offering of the flower, the original plant your hand and even the flower have ceased to exist. Only God alone exists. This is called meditation.

Q: In deep meditation Swamiji, is it true that people can have visions and hear various sounds?

Baba: Yes one can have the experience of hearing sounds (like the ringing of a bell or the blowing of a conch) and also experience visions. Ramakrishna gave Vivekananda the experience of a vision and a temporary state of bliss. It is not possible to have this bliss permanently. The longest one can be in that state is twenty-one days, after which the body drops off or one has to give up that state.

Q: Is it true that Swamiji comes into the mind of a person during the dream state, only if Swamiji desires it?

Baba: O yes, No person can dream of Swami unless Swami Himself desires it to be so.

Q: Sometimes we get very odd mixed up dreams without any meaning and yet Swami is present in those dreams. Why does that happen Swamiji?

Baba: The cause of dreams is sleep. You dream because you slept. Now mixed up dreams arise because of Rajasic (impure) food taken in by the dreamer. Hot or sour foods produce such uncontrolled dreams.

Q: Swamiji, this subject of the mind is very interesting. Sometimes our sense of Time is altered in dreams and different from Time as we know it in the external world. Would Swamiji please tell us something about it?

Baba: Trying to find the beginning and the end of the Universe, is like sitting on a seashore and counting the waves. The beginning is the time when you start counting and the end, is the time when you get fed up and stop. There is no separate God and a separate devotee. There is only One. The energy with which the most subtle particles are bound with each other is Divine. That is God Itself and therefore, God is omnipresent.

These most subtle particles bound by Energy are in a state of tranquility and Oneness. The mind comes into the picture with its thoughts and causes disturbances with duality. Here is an example: There is an airplane flying smoothly. Say it represents the flux of electrons and protons in equilibrium, that is; the airplane is flying very smoothly. Then a cloud appears and causes a bump in the plane, just like a neutron disturbing the relationship of the protons and electrons. That is the mind producing the disturbance of duality, where only One exists.

The individual separation of these Energy particles is precise and cannot be altered. Any separation or merger would mean non-existence of Creation. That is not possible. This Divine Energy is being used by the Scientists in the form of their five senses and in the form of their various instruments, to look for God. That is, using this Divine Energy they are trying to look at the Divine Energy itself. That is not possible to achieve unless the Scientist realises his own true identity (God) by eliminating the senses, mind, body etc.

There is matter in Spirit and Spirit in matter. It is either in wave form or particle form. Everything in the Universe is like that. Scientists are trying to find the origin of the Universe but this can be known only by knowing when Time was born. This is a fruitless task because Time is measured by Work (movement in space) through the five senses and the five layers (kosas—see previous pages). Now the experience of these layers is variable. In deep sleep the experience is Timeless and the urge to measure Time comes only when one is awake. The awareness of Time is thus measurable only when we are awake, and associate with the external world. The experiences of Time using the different layers are different, in the waking state, dream state and deep sleep state.

Take this example of a person whose age in Time is 64 years. In the waking state it appears very large or long and the individual has gone through many and varied experiences and pain and pleasure, over long periods. He goes to sleep, and wakes up to visit the bathroom and notices the Time. It is 3.30 A.M. He goes back to sleep and dreams that he is born, goes to school and college, grows up and becomes a principal of a college, and finally he retires. At that point he wakes up again and looks at the watch. It is now only 3.35 A.M., and he has experienced all this in five minutes. If all the 64 years of walking experience can be had in five minutes in the dream state, then in the super conscious state they can be had in five seconds. Now, of these three which is the correct Time? Is it the 64 years, five minutes or five seconds? How can Time which changes and is perceived according to one’s level of Consciousness be called Real or Truth?

Again, in the Turya (beyond mind) stage of Consciousness even seconds do not exist. Time ceases completely. It does not exist. So Time exists only during the material consciousness, dependent on the existence of the body.

This physical basis or our body, is like a temporary intruder. We become our real Self when it is discarded. So whatever relation we establish with another body, is not a Real relationship. Suppose there is the relationship of mother and son. The mother is sixty years old and the son is thirty years of age. For thirty years he has been calling this other body as ‘mother’. When the mother dies the son laments, ‘O my mother is gone’ even though the body of the mother is still lying there in front of him. So who is it that is gone? If the body was the mother then why should he lament? It is only when the soul inhabits a body that we look up to it with respect, but once the soul has departed the body is discarded. In this instance, the true relationship is between the soul of the mother and the soul of the son. The great advantage of the body is that it helps us in apprehending or contacting the Soul through a body. It is the instrument of contact.

This is one rationale of existence. Man is born not just for the purpose of eating. The spirit becomes manifest through the form. Without the form it would be impossible to recognise the Unmanifest (Spirit). The correct path is then to meditate first on the manifest for, and see the Spirit within it. We can only achieve the goal of experiencing the Unmanifest through the manifest form. The only key is through a manifest form.

To extract the water from the earth we have to bore a deep well. Similarly, we have to strike deep in our heart to seek Divine Consciousness, but we need a 'Water Diviner' before striking in the soil of our heart. Our tongue with God’s Name on it is the machine required for this purpose. If we say sweet words it is like striking soft soil and the progress is fast, but if we say harsh words, it is like coming up against hard rock and the progress is arrested.

Make the soil soft by uttering the name of God. Do not use the tongue for useless words, use it for kind helpful words, then the Delight within can be tapped. All the grief, agony and sorrows of Man proceed from his tongue. Use the minimum number of words or else you will encounter rock, besides wasting energy. Observing silence and such vows means silence of the mind and heart. If you merely keep your lips shut and shout 'hum, hum, hum,' accompanied by various gestures, it is not silence. Silence must be spontaneous and no pain should be caused to others. Real devotion means less talk. Bhajans are only secondary aids to it. Instead of opening the eyes and mouth wide, one should open the heart and experience the love towards all.

To experience Swami’s love you have to carry out in your daily life what Swami wants you to do. Then His love will come to you as grace. If you follow Swami’s ichcha and agna (wishes and words) then Swami will be in your hands and He will not be able to escape.

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